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Forums › Rules & Mechanics › Pathfinder › Playtesting › PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
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Jeremy.Smith
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 08:12 PM
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OK, a fair bit of changes to this class since Alpha 2.
Autohypnosis is now a class skill.
Class gets 4+Int skills (I can't remember if that was a change or not now... just calling it out to be sure)
Altered Defense is now limited per day... I'm not sure I like how it's turned out, so that may change based upon feedback. My thought is a possible limited rounds per day instead of limited uses per day.
Due to concerns about the mechanical repercussions, I have not changed the mechanics of manifesting for the cryptic at the base level. However, the cryptic now has something unique in terms of manifesting:
Pattern Designs (Su): Unlike normal manifesters, a cryptic manipulates the world around her by creating tattoos and patterns that alters reality in different ways. Cryptic powers show up on the cryptic’s body in the form of tattoos. The cryptic’s known powers can be identified via Spellcraft checks with a DC equal to 10 + double the power’s level.
When a cryptic manifests one of her powers, it creates a visual pattern of energy during the action taken to manifest the pattern. Because the cryptic must be able to see the pattern as it is being formed in order for the power to take effect, a cryptic cannot manifest powers when unable to see.
Disrupt Pattern now explicitly states it can only be used once per round. It also deals half damage if not of your active enemy type (chosen at time of gaining focus).
Lesser Insights added (2 talents).
Scribe Tattoo added to the table.
Hidden Pattern is now a competence bonus.
Bypass Pattern now adds 1/2 class level instead of class level. Same on Claim Pattern.
Claim Pattern can only have one active at a time.
New Insights: Discerning Pattern, Disrupted Healing, Steal Tattoo
Empower Trap: Now specifies the 50% bonus is to damage dealt.
Fold Trap: Now only works on unoccupied squares.
Recognize Pattern: now half level bonus instead of level.
Redirect Trap: No longer works with pit traps.
Summoning Pattern: Cryptic and target must both be on same plane as the pattern.
Throw Pattern now explicitly states standard action to avoid confusion.
All the new Supreme Insights previously posted.
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 08:13 PM
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Grrr, for some reason, I can't get it to attach...
Here's a link
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 10:12 PM
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It all looks quite nice to me. Any word on changing the flavor of how they manifest powers, or is that going unchanged? Because I think it'd be really neat if they "learned" powers by inscribing permanent tattoos onto their body (in addition to the normal tattoos granted through Scribe Tattoo).
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 10:16 PM
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You miss this?
"Pattern Designs (Su): Unlike normal manifesters, a cryptic manipulates the world around her by creating tattoos and patterns that alters reality in different ways. Cryptic powers show up on the cryptic’s body in the form of tattoos. The cryptic’s known powers can be identified via Spellcraft checks with a DC equal to 10 + double the power’s level.
When a cryptic manifests one of her powers, it creates a visual pattern of energy during the action taken to manifest the pattern. Because the cryptic must be able to see the pattern as it is being formed in order for the power to take effect, a cryptic cannot manifest powers when unable to see."
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Frerezar
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 10:47 PM
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Looks really great. And regarding Altered Defense, rounds per day sounds quite good to me.
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:38 AM
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What's the finally wording on Disrupting Strikes?
Also, I think it would be a good idea to spell out the creature types and whether Humanoids and Outsiders require a subtype to be chosen like a Ranger (and most similar abilities, a la Bane) or not (as was originally suggested); either way, I feel it should be clarified.
I like the idea of Altered Defense being a free action limited to rounds a day or somesuch.
I absolutely love the idea of the Cryptic's powers being tattooed onto her body, but I feel like an Insight or Feat that either increases the DC or deliberately misguides the viewer into thinking they have a different tattoo than they thought.
"Energy Ray? You must be mistaken, Councilor; that's Fortify."
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:38 AM
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Also, YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY CRYPTIC BETA XD
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Distant_Scholar
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 01:28 AM
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Would a "mental pattern" feat, that allows a cryptic to manifest a power while blinded (perhaps for some cost) be a good idea, or would it take too much of the flavor of the class away?
(I'm thinking it'd be similar to the Silent Spell feat for spells with verbal components.)
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Leshoyadut
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Post subject: Re: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 01:57 AM
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| Jeremy.Smith wrote: |
You miss this?
"Pattern Designs (Su): Unlike normal manifesters, a cryptic manipulates the world around her by creating tattoos and patterns that alters reality in different ways. Cryptic powers show up on the cryptic’s body in the form of tattoos. The cryptic’s known powers can be identified via Spellcraft checks with a DC equal to 10 + double the power’s level.
When a cryptic manifests one of her powers, it creates a visual pattern of energy during the action taken to manifest the pattern. Because the cryptic must be able to see the pattern as it is being formed in order for the power to take effect, a cryptic cannot manifest powers when unable to see." |
Ah-hah! So I did. Well, now I look all silly.
I quite like it.
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Post subject: Re: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 03:22 AM
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| Novawurmson wrote: |
| What's the finally wording on Disrupting Strikes? |
The power? It still exists. I'll be posting a Beta version of it later this week.
| Novawurmson wrote: |
I absolutely love the idea of the Cryptic's powers being tattooed onto her body, but I feel like an Insight or Feat that either increases the DC or deliberately misguides the viewer into thinking they have a different tattoo than they thought.
"Energy Ray? You must be mistaken, Councilor; that's Fortify." |
Andreas also proposed that idea and I neglected to write it up...
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freduncio
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 04:17 AM
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Is the bonus in Bypass/Claim Pattern really necessary? I mean, there's already the bonus from Trapfinding. At 8th level, a Cryptic can bypass/claim a destruction trap (CR 20, DC 34) with a 10+ roll. It shouldn't be easier to him take absolute control of a trap than disarm it (maybe indeed it should be harder). Traps simply pose no challenge for a cryptic with any of these insights. With only the Trapfinding bonus he's already very good dealing with traps, at the same level of a rogue.
Please, get rid of the extra bonus on those insights, and maybe put on a penalty.
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Calain80
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 02:03 PM
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My "insights":
Pattern Designs should probably stand directly behind Maximum Power Level Known.
Also Pattern Designs should probably mention, that these power tattoos do not count as psionic tattoos for the number of tattoos you can have on your body. (or that they do not take up the space of a psionic tattoo.)
Summoning Pattern should probably be:
create a unique pattern at location (without the at a location)
Otherwise it could be misread that you don't need to be at the location where the pattern is created. (At least I could misread it. ;))
Enhanced Disruption should probably mention that while it is not multiplied it is halved if it is not the active enemy type.
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 03:02 PM
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So with regards to the competence bonus on Bypass / Claim, I checked out some sample traps at varying CRs. First, if the bonus is removed.
At CR 2 (DC 20), and a Cryptic with max skill ranks and an 18 Dex would have a 65% chance of being able to use the ability. 2 ranks, 4 dex, 3 class skill, 1 trapfinding, 2 masterwork tools = +12
At CR 7 (DC 31), and the Cryptic with a 20 Dex and a +2 belt, he would have a 55% chance of being successful. 7 ranks, 6 Dex, 3 Class skill, 3 trapfinding, +2 tools = +21
At CR 16 (DC 33), and the Cryptic with a 22 Dex and a +6 belt and a +3 tome, he would have a 100% chance.
If the bonus is added back, that goes to a 70% chance at both CR 2 and CR 7.
Now obviously, there are other means of increasing skill bonus - Goggles of Minute Seeing would give a 25% boost, and are affordable at level 7.
Given that, I think removing the competence bonus might actually be justified.
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Tue May 01, 2012 03:03 PM
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BTW, Calain, all of your recommendations have been incorporated.
Altered Defense is also now a Swift Action to activate, Rapid Defense is now a free action even when not on turn, and Enduring Defense is now:
Enduring Defense: A cryptic of 14th level can choose any option from the Altered Defense ability and always be under that effect. The cryptic can still change the effect as a swift action, but she is no longer limited to how many rounds per day she can have Altered Defense active.
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Wed May 09, 2012 04:34 PM
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In the altered defense description there is a reference to something called "protective armor", but in the pdf there is no other mention to this.
I don't like that the cryptic has to see to manifest his powers, as that introduces a very important weakness in the class. A simple 2nd level spell disables his manifesting, when all other psionic classes can manifest their powers in nearly any situation. I'd add an insupressable visual display to all cryptic powers and leave it at that.
Please make clear if the Eternal Pattern supreme insight grants immortality, and if not I think it should.
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Post subject: Re: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 12:38 AM
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| cotilla wrote: |
| In the altered defense description there is a reference to something called "protective armor", but in the pdf there is no other mention to this. |
I think it's just a reference to the cryptic's armor with a flavorful descriptor. I could be wrong, though.
| Quote:: |
| I don't like that the cryptic has to see to manifest his powers, as that introduces a very important weakness in the class. A simple 2nd level spell disables his manifesting, when all other psionic classes can manifest their powers in nearly any situation. I'd add an insupressable visual display to all cryptic powers and leave it at that. |
I somewhat agree with this. I think it's an interesting idea, kind of along the lines of material components (just with your eyes instead of your hands), and its flavor fits the class (being able to see and manipulate patterns). I think, however, we could probably make a feat that allows the cryptic to skip this, a la Eschew Materials for wizards. I don't think that'd be too powerful.
| Quote:: |
| Please make clear if the Eternal Pattern supreme insight grants immortality, and if not I think it should. |
Given its wording, I suspect it isn't supposed to give immortality, in the same way that Timeless Body prevents aging penalties, but doesn't make one stop aging. At least, that's how I interpreted the ability.
Also, is there any possibility of expanding the cryptic power list? It feels a bit limited after 2nd level powers.
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Post subject: Re: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 08:52 AM
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| Leshoyadut wrote: |
Also, is there any possibility of expanding the cryptic power list? It feels a bit limited after 2nd level powers. |
main difficulty with that is that you've got a whole heck of a lot going on with the cryptic. good skills, a suite of abilities, and manifesting. gotta be careful not to make it *too* much (though of course, you also don't want to give too little).
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 01:40 PM
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I will say that I wouldn't mourn a Cryptic/Dread bonus power pdf at some point; both of them have quite restricted lists at some levels.
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Post subject: Re: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 05:13 PM
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| Jaid wrote: |
main difficulty with that is that you've got a whole heck of a lot going on with the cryptic. good skills, a suite of abilities, and manifesting. gotta be careful not to make it *too* much (though of course, you also don't want to give too little). |
I agree entirely, which is why I think it definitely has to be done carefully, but it does feel really limited after 2nd level.
Evade burst is made useless by evasion, escape detection is covered by the vitalist (gets powers through her collective, grabs it from the psion), sharpened edge doesn't stack with keen, danger sense is kind of limited in use (though the hour/level duration helps with that, and it does depend on the adventure/GM; it is definitely more beneficial in some places than it is in others, though I'd still really rather just avoid the trap in the first place), and while ectoplasmic grapnel sounds interesting, there's no description of what the "variety of functions" it does currently, so I can't really roll with that one, and I have the remaining two on the list. [edit] Nope, I'm a dummy. It's in Master the Battle.[/edit]
I realize that not everyone has access to a vitalist or tactician who can get escape detection from a party psion, so that can definitely be more useful to some (especially if you have a problem with divining villains), but I don't really feel like any of these are great picks for the Disrupt Pattern-focused cryptic beyond greater concealing amorpha and dispel psionics.
I don't think damaging powers would be terribly appropriate for the cryptic, but definitely self-buffs, and possibly some debuffs would definitely fit the idea of manipulating a target's pattern to cause harm. Dimension slide, hustle, and body adjustment as 3rd level powers all stand out to me as potentials. Mental barrier could also work, and maybe psionic blast as a 4th or 5th level power. Control body (or something similar) might work as a 5th or 6th level power. Maybe specified energy adaptation for 3rd? I don't know. Just trying to spitball some ideas here, so I haven't looked into possible overpowered combinations with existing cryptic powers/insights/other abilities, but I think there is a lot of potential there for buffing and debuffing.
Last edited by Leshoyadut on Fri May 11, 2012 06:48 PM; edited 1 times in total
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Post subject: PsiEx - BETA - Cryptic Base Class
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 06:33 PM
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I'm confused on you not knowing what Ectoplasmic Grapnel can do. It has a pretty extensive write-up in Master the Battle.
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